Unknown Speaker 0:00
Hi, Shauna,
Unknown Speaker 0:02
I'm so excited to have you here.
Unknown Speaker 0:04
I always kind of kick started my podcasts by having my guest. Tell me a little bit about yourself.
Unknown Speaker 0:11
Who you are what you do how you got here. Okay. Yeah, that sounds good. So I'm Shawna and we met through Instagram, Renee, I've actually followed you for a really long time on Instagram. And just like me, in a nutshell, I am a counselor. I also work part time as a environmental health officer with our health authority. But mainly I'm a counselor, I'm a coach. And I'm really passionate about helping women live life on purpose, simplify, like all of these messages that you share. I am just like another voice saying, Hey, this is a great way to do things. It can bring you a lot of freedom. And that's kind of me in a nutshell it. Also I'm a mom, I'm married. I live in Canada, those kinds of things. Yeah, that's what before we started our call, I was freaking out because she lives in British Columbia, Canada, which is one of the most beautiful places I've ever seen. Not in person yet. But
Unknown Speaker 1:03
yeah, not yet. Oh, that's so great China. So I'm curious as to what kind of inspired you to want to help people simplify or what, what made you want to help women start simplifying specifically, I think I came across it by chance as most of us do, because decluttering wasn't really like a big theme. Back when I first learned about it. I was I was blogging, I had left my job as a health inspector after two kids, because we didn't have daycare in our little town and my daughter, she cried all the time. So I was like, who is going to want to take two of these children. So I'm at home and with my kids, and I'm just writing I'm just blogging about mom life and that kind of thing. And along the way, have another baby, learn about decluttering. And it was like the it was like a trap door opened underneath me almost to learn about decluttering, I had read the book, The Joy of less by Francine J. And I had read it just after Christmas. And it was like someone had given me permission to get rid of stuff that I didn't want. And I didn't need and I could kind of look at my parents and how they have just everything like that. They just keep so much stuff. And I kind of looked at and thought if that's my future. And I can choose differently, I'm going to choose differently. And so I started just sharing that on the blog, I renamed the blog from that point and called it simple on purpose. And just started sharing with really no intention other than being accountable and sharing the process with people. Then I got trained as a coach, and then I got trained as a counselor. And so just kind of bringing all of those into how I worked with people how I worked with women, it just became a very natural thing, I think, to have those conversations around simplifying and intentional living. I love that. What was your blog called before? It was called dovetail blog? Okay, yeah, that's so funny. When you saw that I'm like, Oh, my gosh, I changed the name of mine as well. I started it called heart, soul and Whole Foods, because I was like, at the time, I had just done like holistic nutrition certification, and was really passionate about that. So I was trying really hard. But something is a theme I've seen in my life is whenever I try too hard at something, it's not meant for me, you know, whenever I'm like, or whenever I forced something or tried to think I have to show up a certain way. It's not. Wow, yeah. Right. And that's, I started documenting our journey through minimalism.
Unknown Speaker 3:28
And I was like, wow, people actually are responding to this message. So I renamed my my blog, the fun side of life. So yeah, I that's how I found you. Yeah.
Unknown Speaker 3:38
I probably found you on Pinterest and followed you on Instagram. Oh, my gosh. Well, I hope you found good things. Yeah, obviously. I was here.
Unknown Speaker 3:47
Still be hanging out with me. Right? Yeah. Oh, that's so funny. I just went funny. I just like, oh, some of these definitely need to be revamped.
Unknown Speaker 3:56
We have this as we go. Right, right. Yeah.
Unknown Speaker 4:01
Oh, my gosh. And I love that you said you kind of needed permission to declutter. I had already gone through the process. I feel like when I was in my, before I started the blog, I would read other mom blogs and things like that. And there were so many. I'm wondering if you may be found this too. There were so many that were about organization. And the organization was like pretty perfect, white serene. Everything was glass jar containers, everything was perfectly labeled. And it was like, I have to be that or I'm failing. Perhaps Riley? Yeah, I tried the over organizations so much. Did you feel like you'd ever come across those kinds of things? Yeah. People made organizations organization look really easy and effortless and something that if you do it right, then you never have to do work like to maintain it. So I thought, like organization was something I was just personally a failure in. Because I think that's the
Unknown Speaker 5:00
Other stuff they don't tell you is, it might not be for you, you might not like putting things into I hate putting things into jars. Like I just shared my spice jar in my newsletter that I send out because I'm like, Guys, spice jars are not for me. I want the bags, I want it, you know, like a trash raccoon lives in this jar. And there's stuff everywhere. But I got to pour things in little containers and write on. It just seems like so much work. And if it's not for you, it's not for you, you really got to find how it's going to work for you. But I totally know what you say, especially back then maybe 10 years ago. We're on Pinterest a lot. We're on Instagram a lot. And we're seeing this aesthetic take over the totality of social media that we think everything like I'm in a white office, but we think everything had to be suddenly painted white. And the kitchens had to be white. And we had to have all these like certain aesthetics. To just even post ourselves on social media, it almost felt like that we needed to match up with all of that.
Unknown Speaker 6:02
But you know, the more you kind of dig into just how people live like you go to your friend's house, and you're like, I'm comfortable here like it's a normal home with normal people. And there's a basket of laundry and I just feel like peaceful here. I don't need that pristine, beautiful space to be in. I don't I don't think I need it. I mean, there's always laundry in my living room at all times. It's like an emotional support basket of laundry is always there.
Unknown Speaker 6:28
Oh my gosh, that's so funny. You're so right. I liked that. You said Didn't you want to show ourselves on social media?
Unknown Speaker 6:35
For big chunk of it. So I was doing decluttering I was practicing the minimal minimalism de minimalism. I was practicing minimalism, and I was sharing it on the blog. But I felt like I cannot share this on Instagram because I don't have the perfect white, you know, my kitchen, ugly oak, or it's painted white now, thanks to COVID I would like as well to take a chance on.
Unknown Speaker 6:59
But, you know, it's but it's still not like the perfect new, modern, beautiful, you know, yeah, yeah, minimalist, or Instagram minimalist aesthetic that we think about? Yeah. So I kept putting it off and kept putting it off.
Unknown Speaker 7:14
And it's so silly. I think we do that so much, where it's so easy to look at these unrealistic images that not everybody is truly living that way. We all do have clutter in laundry. And that was, that's something I'm trying to really bring to my messaging.
Unknown Speaker 7:33
And it sounds like you are to with your Spicer and spice store, you know,
Unknown Speaker 7:41
that, like you can still practice simplicity, you can still practice minimalism and decluttering while also having a pile of laundry, in your living salutely. Yeah. And I love that. There is also that voice that says, hey, like we I do hashtag we live here that we're minimalists. But we still live here. Like if I go down to my basement, there's my kids have stuff everywhere. But we live here like this is how I wanted to use the space in my basement before minimalism was full. Like there was a pathway through my basement, there was boxes and workout equipment and just random like kids clothes, so much kids clothes, right. But now it's just this big space full of, you know, video games and hockey equipment and costumes. And I that's what I wanted. I wanted a space that was messy on purpose, like messy for a good reason that there's kids here and they're using this space, and they live in it. And I totally feel that I sometimes I'm like, I don't want to share my space online. People will be judging me people be like, Oh, I thought you were a minimalist.
Unknown Speaker 8:42
But it is it is truly its posture, right? Like it's an approach to life more than it is an organization or buying containers at the store and putting them in a certain way. Like it really is how you're approaching life, I think. Oh, for sure. And that's so funny that you say that. I'm like, Wow, just lots of little things in common. But when we downsized our house, we moved into What would someone would call like a starter home, you know, it's just the one top levels finish. It's a one level. But the basement was completely unfinished. And I was like, yes, because my grandma grew up with an unfinished basement like so when I would go to my grandma's house. I could rollerblade down there I could put and I could trash the place and it was fine. Totally. So that's what my kids play room has been an unfinished basement. Now they're almost 13 and 14 and laying is dying down. But the costumes that were everywhere and the doors and there's chalk on the walls. Definitely not meeting minimalist aesthetic.
Unknown Speaker 9:50
Intentional, it's it was an intentional choice, right? Exam. Oh, you had a basement that was literally felt did you go through
Unknown Speaker 10:00
How much stuff did you have to clear through to kind of
Unknown Speaker 10:04
be wanted, right? So I read that book. And I think I finished it, closed it. And I said to my husband, I'm going downstairs like if I don't come back, I love you take care of the children. And I just started going through boxes in I would go down most afternoons when he would come home from work. And I would cry a lot to Renee, like, I was really feeling like I was just face to face, within the word that kept popping up for me was complacency, like been so complacent. And mind you this was also a time in my life that I had just come off of where my relationship with my husband was struggling, I was struggling as a mom, I had so much anxiety. I like my body, I wasn't paying attention to it, I was sore all over and tired and just felt so depleted in so many ways. And to me, I was being complacent, I was just letting these things just happen on autopilot, just being reactive. And so seeing this physical representation of my complacency, it really just brought me face to face with me as a person and how I was living. It's really humbling, used to ugly cry in the basement, and just go through boxes and boxes, and we got rid of truckloads of stuff. I helped furnish my niece's new home with stuff from our kitchen. And we basically had a second set of living room, furniture in our basement, because we had, of course, replaced the upstairs and put the old stuff downstairs, all those kinds of things, right. So there was just a lot of stuff to go through. And it's funny to talk about the like, the images that we have of our home because I decluttered for a year, and I took before and after pictures. And if you look on the surface, you're like, I don't see that much, except for the basement. But it did feel a little bit defeating to be like, No, you don't understand. Like, if you won't get into jour, it looks different in there. So as we could actually clear out furniture furniture felt like the big wins for sure. But still going through those drawers going through those closets. It's not something that you just do once like you would know, right? It's not something you just do once I haven't decluttering every week, a drawer or something because life happens, things get full again, things go on autopilot, and it just gets filled up again. So you constantly have to be decluttering. That's what people need to remember. It's not just one and done. It's a routine. But it can be. It can be really thoughtful and intentional. Sometimes it can be kind of a practice. It sounds really nerdy, but I feel good. When I declutter, like my closet, especially. I don't know why maybe just you know, if I hide need to go shopping, I need I need this piece of clothing and tell yourself in your brain. But then you go into your closet and you stand there and you look at what you actually do have. And you start like pulling out things that you do love. You kind of reward yourself in that way you kind of shop your own closet in a way and for me decluttering has become just a like sometimes I don't want to do it. And I just don't but it has become something that I don't mentally fight like I get a lot of value from it. Yeah. Oh, you're so right. Okay. It's so crazy. I feel like you everything you say I'm like, me, too. Me too.
Unknown Speaker 13:13
And I don't know if you know that or if you've heard that. But that was also like where my decluttering I had always decluttered like I would always do like the spring cleaning session and things like that. But I had this realization that I was like, I've never it was like, I would declutter and then immediately be like, now I wouldn't buy a bunch of stuff again, I would just fill it right back up. I stayed overwhelmed. But when I finally got intentional, it was when everything was falling apart. It was like,
Unknown Speaker 13:39
my marriage was struggling. We were struggling financially, it was just everything felt so overwhelming. And that's when I kind of got to the point that I was just kind of tired of the cycle of it.
Unknown Speaker 13:53
But also, you know, you're right, like the decluttering. As you're saying this, I'm thinking about my life and my journey where it's like, I don't declutter as much as I used to. But I also think I don't, it's not as big of a production as it used to be. Yeah, I used to do those big spring cleaning sessions. And now it's like, My daughter just got some new clothes. She's going to be 14 and five days. Oh, my gosh, you get the calendar like no, that's insane. But we
Unknown Speaker 14:22
she, I said you want to go buy some new clothes because she's been saying she needs new clothes. I'll actually do a clothes shopping trip, or did you want to do a bigger party, and she chose the clothes shopping. So we went did a bunch of calls. And I told her and she knows it was like we're doing a quick declutter of the closet. New clothes come and so now it's just kind of like part of my like life routine, like you know, before Christmas is before birthdays.
Unknown Speaker 14:49
And it brings me back to kind of similar like to what you said it like to a neutral state. Things start to feel a little bit cluttered. It's kind of nice to come back to that
Unknown Speaker 15:00
Like a more level place. Does that make sense? It totally does. It's yeah, it's just making space, right? If you want to bring more in, like you could, but you'll be full you'll be overrides.
Unknown Speaker 15:12
So just yeah. Just creating that calm before the storm sometimes. Especially Christmas, right? Yes. Yeah. Oh my gosh. Oh, that's lately, I've been thinking. And I just shared something on Instagram about this. But we put I can say this without crying now. We put our dog down on Friday. And my house has gotten just kind of messy and kind of gross. There's like paper clippings on the floor, because my kids still don't know how to pick up their cubicle, you know, they still don't want to pick up after themselves. There's crumbs everywhere. But
Unknown Speaker 15:43
I am so thankful that I've done the work of decluttering because it feels manageable to me now. Yeah, yeah, getting back to that sense of normalcy, that sense of clean, or, you know, peace versus like, when you were saying, and you go in the basement, and there's boxes everywhere. And when you're feeling overwhelmed in your life, and, you know, you're seeing it physically shoved through your stuff. You know, it feels so good to not have that stuff to have to worry about. Yeah, I think a lot can be said, for our habits, I think, you know, we brush our teeth every day, if we miss a day, it's fine, because we brush our teeth every day. And just like you putting in the work of setting up routines and systems and doing the physical work of decluttering. So that when you do the time, where life is really hard, and it causes you to just like slow down and not do anything, you can do that because you've put the work in ahead of time. And you know enough about yourself that you're going to continue with it later down the road. So I think there's a bit more hopefulness and maybe permission that we give ourselves that kind of rest when we are doing the things regularly that set us up for that, I think Oh, absolutely. So were you always like,
Unknown Speaker 17:02
because you went through the process of decontrol kind of clearing space. And like, I love that my house feels easy to manage during the hard times. And I went through a lot of hard times as soon as I started decluttering, which just reinforced to me like, I need a life I need a home that feels easy when everything else feels hard.
Unknown Speaker 17:20
So I'm curious, you know, what was your kind of end goal hope besides just you know, not ending up like your parents with an over cluttered home? Did you kind of have a vision for what you wanted your home and life to be like after? You know, at the very beginning, I think it was just like cleaning out the basement. And then maybe there was a part of me as I would read about minimalism and looking at other people's homes that was buying really into that aesthetic minimalism that I can get a house that looks like this. If I just declutter my house could actually look like everyone I see on the internet. So there was definitely a part of me that thought that was going to be the end goal. Like that's what I should aspire to, or, you know, the, like moving towards but you know, as we just went along, and, and started paying attention at what we were decluttering and realizing there's some stuff we didn't want to declutter, there's some stuff that we wanted a lot of like, my kids have a buttload of Legos and people come in, they're like, it's just a lot of Legos. And it is we've acquired some, you know, we inherited it from my husband, his mom has saved them all, thankfully, so we didn't have to buy a like buckets of Legos. But we have a lot because our kids use it. And they would like fill up the kitchen. Like we had a dresser in our kitchen for a long time did fill it up. And just realizing that there's actually things that we're not going to ever fully get rid of by minimalist standards, because that's our values. Those are the things we want as a family. And as I would do that more and more because the kids were pretty young than when we were going through this at first. It just gave me a little bit more permission to think about well, what does minimalism look like for us as a family for? For me, what do I actually like? What do I want to keep? So it helps me both get rid of a lot of things that weren't in line with what I was realizing I wanted. And then it also gives me permission to keep the things like we love hosting people and having like a full house and all the neighborhood kids come over. So we're gonna have buckets and bowls for popcorn and we're gonna have extra utensils somewhere in the house. You know, things like that. Just giving myself permission that that's what minimalism actually looked like for us. And like you say, like, it's just something you keep doing. It's not really that. I'll declutter and then my life will be easy. It's that routine right of going back into the closet going back into the jar and just editing it decluttering it again. Yeah. I love that. You touched on that because I think that's such a tough line to walk and it's something like you said people say to you about the Legos and I start
Unknown Speaker 20:00
I just started trying to be more intentional with growing my YouTube. And then everything went to hell in my life. But I haven't done any for like three weeks, which is fine. But I had a comment from somewhere like you don't look minimalist, your blanket has a pattern on it and you have a thing you have Oh, no. Oh, and there's stuff on your nightstand. I'm like, is there not stuff on your nightstand? Like I don't want to live in a depressed home.
Unknown Speaker 20:23
Or I can have my book at my on my nightstand and a photo of my grandmother and
Unknown Speaker 20:29
yeah, that my kids can have Mike for my kids. It was the dress ups, we just embrace the dress UPS bring them all because they're going to be used and they're going to be played with and they're going to be enjoyed. And that's the kind of home that I want. Totally, totally. Yeah, yeah. And that hosting thing. I'm like, I have to I'm like, preach. I just love it. Because I had another comment. People have to say they're all their opinions, right? You have too many bowls to be a minimalist, and it was like, Oh, what is the perfect number of bowls for me? God, can you tell me what?
Unknown Speaker 21:00
You know? Yeah, I said, we have an extended family. We've got two kids that don't live in our house. We've got family that come over, we host Christmas and things. And I said I don't like buying paper plates or things like that. So I love to be able to have as much utensils and bowls available. So that into me, then that's minimalism. I'm not bringing waste into my home. And we're not if we can avoid it, you know, there are times that we definitely do.
Unknown Speaker 21:28
But be intentional. So I think that's so important for anybody listening.
Unknown Speaker 21:32
To always ask yourself, like, what will this look like for me? Yeah, because it sounds like you maybe it felt this way. But I did where like,
Unknown Speaker 21:42
I felt like I can only have this much, or I don't get to call myself a minimalist. Right? Yeah, there was like pages on websites that said how much you should have in your house and stuff like that. And that how much you should get rid of and, and you can see pictures of like living rooms where there's just a couch and like a table. And you know if that works for someone great, but I felt like you like I want this to be my my home like I want to feel at home here. I want a nightstand that has all like, my special stuff on it my books and my water and like, you know, my all my chargers and all this stuff like, this is my space. It's not anyone else's space. And minimalism is really about paying attention to yourself, right? More than anything else. It's about paying attention to yourself. Right and knowing what works for your family.
Unknown Speaker 22:33
So I was curious to as you were saying, you know, things kind of felt chaotic when you started decluttering have things shifted since? Mm hmm. Yeah, I know, people are like, if I declutter, then I'll feel peaceful, right? That's usually the if, if this then that, that people have if I declutter, then I'll feel peaceful. And I was learning as moms do that. Things don't feel peaceful, if I'm not feeling peaceful, so I could have the cleanest, most tidy home. And if I'm not feeling peaceful, if I'm still like up there about everything, there's not going to be peace in that home no matter how much decluttering I did. So definitely, that was the work for me, I think is managing through a lot of anxiety I naturally had and then bring kids into the picture. And taking responsibility for how I was showing up in my home almost decluttering my own self, my own heart, my own mind, so that I could show up and, and not
Unknown Speaker 23:29
operate from a state of chaos. Even if my home felt like it was manageable, that I had to do that work myself as well.
Unknown Speaker 23:38
I like that you say that, because that's something I've struggled to find the words for, because it's a tricky thing to say. Especially when, like you said you for so long the minimalist or decluttering space has been, here's how many pairs of pants you can own. And here's how many books you need to declutter.
Unknown Speaker 23:56
It's been so surface level in numbers or systems. Yeah. But for me, it was also that too, it was. I did a lot of learning about myself through the process of decluttering.
Unknown Speaker 24:10
But I also is you're talking about you know, you've kind of always struggled with anxiety and things like that.
Unknown Speaker 24:18
I've, for me, I found it very therapeutic to kind of, we're through and eliminate
Unknown Speaker 24:28
some of the excess. So like, this is what I was thinking. I'm like,
Unknown Speaker 24:32
I've always tried to tell people like, I'm not trying to mean a minimalist aesthetic. I'm not trying to have my home look any certain way, necessarily. That's not why I'm doing this. But I said, my brain feels so busy. It's so nice to not have my space or my systems feel like that. Yeah, yeah, I think and like we both know there's all that science around how your environment is impacts your mental state and your emotional state and
Unknown Speaker 25:00
It's just one less thing to think about, you know, people can drop by my house. And sure there's that basket of laundry, and maybe the floors haven't been swept. But things are fine. Like, I'm not going to be feeling on edge. And I think that's also like personal work I've done to to have just people come in and just be like, This is me, this is my house, it's fine. Like, we're fine, everyone's fine. You can have a seat at the table, and it's going to be clear enough for you. And maybe I'll feed you something from the pantry, like things are fine. So that's Yeah, I think that's really part of the process is just,
Unknown Speaker 25:34
you know, your energy is limited, or like we are limited in our time, and our energy and our space, like these are all things that we're limited in. And so to put it in the places where it best is served, and decluttering is just a tool that you can use to manage your energy while I think.
Unknown Speaker 25:52
Do you feel like, did you have to do any work around? So like, what is your home like before you started decluttering is kind of what I'm wondering, were you because this is how I was now what I'm saying it
Unknown Speaker 26:04
where I felt like this deep need to always have the perfect looking home, I wanted things to be nice and organized. Like I said, I would buy all the organizational systems or feel like I had to do that. Where you're saying the work of like letting people just come into your space?
Unknown Speaker 26:20
And have it be a little messy? Do you feel like there are some you found any freedom in that? I'm not quite sure what I'm trying to say but like, there, because I relate to what you're saying. I feel that same way where before, it used to be like a lot of anxiety around making sure I had a perfect home. And now that I have a little bit less, maybe it is because my home is easier to manage. But also maybe because I've let go of a lot of those expectations that I had for what my house should look like. That's what I'm trying to say. Right, right, like you let go of a lot of your expectations that you put on yourself. Yeah, I think it's both for sure. And you asked what my home looked like before. And just kids like I had my three kids and three and a half years. So it was just kind of survival mode. Really, there was stuff all over the counters, you know, bottles and snack dishes and like snacks lined up on the table and all the all the baby stuff and all the kids stuff. It was an explosion of kid things. It was confined, like their radius was pretty small back then it was confined to you know, the kitchen and the living room, it's all open. But it was a lot of kids stuff. And if someone would have dropped in, I would have felt like they're looking at this mom and being like, she's she's your typical stay at home mom just like rolling around, and Legos and dirty laundry, I probably would have felt like that for sure. And just, you know, managing kids as well. So doing the work of paying attention to how I was talking to myself about my house and what people were thinking about me. And it. I think now we have so many great like memes and articles that point out just how people really don't care. You know, those memes where someone comes into your house, and they're like, this is what my wife thinks people do when they come over to visit. And it's someone like looking under the couches, and like swiping the windows, like, Oh, look at that stuff. That's what we think is gonna happen. But we know that when we go into someone's house, we're just there to hang out with them. People just want to feel like you enjoy their company, and you're interested in them more than they care about what's on your counters, or that basket of laundry on your couch. In fact, I feel more comfortable when I go to my friend's house and they let me see that side of themselves, where they can just leave stuff out. Or they can just be you know, maybe wiping down the counters while they're talking to me whatever doing their thing. While I'm there that they can just continue on living their life. I feel like a closeness and intimacy with them almost, with I'm not seeing this perfect, stressed out curated image of somebody and what they're trying to present to me. Right. Oh, you're so right. And that's, I hope and I see that there's a shift happening in social media as far as like Instagram and things where people are showing that side of themselves. Because you're right there is a calming piece and knowing like wow, okay, we're all just normal.
Unknown Speaker 29:21
You know, it's, it's so freeing.
Unknown Speaker 29:26
And I remember doing like a video years ago, I was saying like, I think we should start apologizing if people come over and our houses are clean. I'm so sorry. Oh my god. I hope you know it doesn't never looks like this. I just cleaned. Never. Yeah, sorry. If you feel like this is my home looks like it doesn't you know, I think there is a little bit of a rush or that we almost do that these days. Because we're in this era of like authenticity and be real and yeah, my home is messy too, that sometimes when someone comes over I'm like I just swept your well
Unknown Speaker 30:00
got like, we just did shores. This is what this you came on a good day like that like pressure a little bit to share that as well that, hey, I don't have it all together like my house gets messy to that I think we're in an era where we do try to share that as well.
Unknown Speaker 30:17
I'm so glad to be in it. Just how old are your kids? I should ask. Yeah, so one just turned 13. And the other ones are going to be 12 in 10. Soon. Okay, so we were probably in the thick of it together. Yeah.
Unknown Speaker 30:32
That's, I think back to that time. And I think it was so largely perfect motherhood was all that was shown or allowed. So I always felt like I was failing.
Unknown Speaker 30:45
Or like, yeah, that's something was missing. And I really liked that. We had the big exercisers everywhere the babies all in the living room.
Unknown Speaker 30:55
Find confined clutter. Yeah. But it was so tough to see. I would have loved to have seen or heard more conversations like this. Yeah, just know. Right? Yeah. And the money too, right? Like you would look at other kids bedrooms, from bloggers online. And I felt that expectation that my kids should have a certain aesthetic in their bedroom, instead of how many down marketplace furniture that they actually did have. And, you know, I wouldn't, I wouldn't have put my kids bedrooms up in a category with what we saw on the internet. But I also wasn't going to spend that money like I didn't, I couldn't have done that. And your kids, you know, they change every year, their furniture needs to change all of the time. It's crazy. But I think yeah, just letting go of how we were told it was going to look and stepping into the power where we're not cookie cutters. Like we're not all meant to have the same list of things and live the same way and have the same aesthetic, like our homes. But the biggest compliment I get is someone saying your home feels like you. Like if I could have looked at that tile, I would have said that Shawn and I have had friends that say that to me. And that is the goal. That's the ultimate goal, right? For me to be in my own home and be like, Oh, I just like I love all my decisions. And they're not the trendiest or maybe they're trendy now. But I'm gonna love them like this, I type something that I was drawn to and attracted to and pulled into, versus what I felt like it had to look like versus the template that I could just pull off the internet that this is all a reflection of our family and what we want and who we are and what's important to us. And that's what I want people to feel like, I want to feel like that when I go into someone's house. I want to know someone through their home. Right? Instead of being like, this looks like a replica of home goods. Yeah, like a copy paste version of something. Which, again, if that's what you if that's what you love, but I can't help but feel like is there any of you in that home anywhere? I hope so. But I love that you touched on the kids rooms, because when you're talking about Legos, I was thinking about that. And I felt that way. Especially when I started to want to be more minimalist. Any minimalist kids bedroom that I came across was like green walls, white furniture, a single white tent with neutral colored techniques. The tent. Yeah, I don't like the town would be cool. But like mine was like pink and blue. And you know, like we Yeah, did was chaos. And I my daughter was like I want like frozen blanket, you know, like a frozen comforter. Yeah. Like no. Neutral only like, I was like, yeah, it has to look perfect.
Unknown Speaker 33:46
Of course, I let her have the frozen stuff. And you know, but that was part of me needing to let go of that idea of my home should look like.
Unknown Speaker 33:55
And so now I try and thank you for encouraging me. I'm like, maybe I need to do this more. I try to share that my kids rooms are normal, messy teenage rooms. I practice minimalism, but I don't force my kids to meet some sort of aesthetic or standard. For
Unknown Speaker 34:15
any app. I worked in the process of trying to like help them Declutter. So I'm curious if you do that with yours as well, like, yeah, I've taught them to manage their things, but not force a limit on them. Yeah, yeah, that was one that I really like, mulled around a lot when I started. And I will say one of my three kids is not she she enjoys chaos, like she can embrace that. Her room is just like, Yeah, it's like a tornado went through it really. And it's right down our main hallway right across the bathroom. So I'm sure if people are walking down the hallway, they'll look and be like, Oh, I thought this mom was a minimalist, and that's fine. I think it's really the kid dependency.
Unknown Speaker 35:00
You know, I have one kid who lines everything up and things are ordered and one kid who there's a trail literally through the house, I could find them by the trail they leave behind. And I will help them all like, Hey, I'm here, let's do this together, or I'll do it for them. Sometimes people are like, Oh, you shouldn't have to do your kids rooms. But sometimes I just gotta go in and make these decisions for them. There's stuff in there that doesn't need to be kept. And they've always thanked me. They've always said thank you after. And I think that's my own dad has been like, you know what, this is what your room looked like, when you were a kid. And part of me doesn't believe him. Part of me thinks he's exaggerating. But, you know, that just gives me hope, also, that she's just on her own journey. Like, she's messy right now. And she'll figure it out. And, you know, maybe she just needs some mice in there to, to, you know, inspire her to do something.
Unknown Speaker 35:52
But I will go in there and help her. And as she gets older, and she thinks like, I want my friends to hang on here, she's taking a little more ownership of what a room looks like. And every time every time that her room is clean, I stand in there with her and especially when she was littler, I would do this with her be like how do you feel? Notice how you feel right now? How does your room feel? What can you use this for? Now that you can use your floor and your desk is clear? What are you going to do here? So I want to just help her to keep like feeling that because habits are created by emotion, right? So I want her to keep feeling that reward of how it feels. It's doesn't that sound so weird, I want my kid to feel rewarded by cleaning. But we do, right. That's how we feel when we've, you know, cleaned out of the love of our home instead of out of resentment about doing chores. But when we've actually said, I own this space, I want it to look a certain way, like I'm taking ownership of this. And I want to clean the kitchen because I want a clean kitchen. So I'm gonna go clean the kitchen thanks me, like thank you, me. Instead of you know, the opposite we can do which is a lot of resentment. And our kids pick up on that. They'll probably approach chores the same way if we're complaining and resentful. And no one ever helps me and I have to do everything like our kids. We're gonna kind of take that as a bit of a blueprint for how to approach taking care of a home I think, Oh, you're so right. And that's the mouse thing makes me laugh. I'm like, just throw a plant in there. Go stop at the pet store. And I said, yeah.
Unknown Speaker 37:22
But like, I love that you said that though, because my room was very messy. I can confirm I don't need. I don't need anyone to tell me it was it was such a mess. I played this game with myself when I was probably about 12 where I would look at the open spots on my floor where there wasn't garbage. Like where there wasn't clutter. It was usually at close, you know? Yeah, necessarily garbage. I wasn't quite there. But I would be like, Okay, I can jump there. And then I'll jump there. And then I'll be in bed. So it's like my fun like nighttime routine. I was shut off my like, jump, jump, jump jump. And it was like, Yeah, made it without touching any of the crap.
Unknown Speaker 37:58
But I also remember, like you said, like you're doing with your daughter, I remember when I would clean my room, I would get these bursts of motivation to clean. And I would sit on my bed and be like,
Unknown Speaker 38:09
Oh, great. It felt so good. Yeah. So to kind of give her that moment's pause and make her a little bit more aware of that is so huge. Yeah, I'm hoping in the long run. It'll pay off. Yeah, that because I like you say I remember cleaning my room and being so proud and being like, my whole family come in to, like, I did this thing. And I'm so proud of it. Yeah, that's a whole family come in. You're right. You're right. Yeah. Yeah. And that's what I
Unknown Speaker 38:40
I have, over the last few years really worked with my kids to teach them the process of decluttering. I have like a four bin system that has worked for me that like I share any talk about it didn't start with bins. For me it started with piles, but now I use the band because it's easier for visual but I use the bins with my kids.
Unknown Speaker 38:59
So I have the bins I brought them into homes before when I've helped people declutter because it's just easy to sort. But having them with my kids has been so handy. But I don't always I recently just went through my son's room and was like, because like you said, you have that kid who's kind of a clever cluster. They prefer the tornado the chaos. Yeah. He's always been like a builder and inventor. Like he would take stuff from our recycling bin and build like a little robot looking thing or he'd build like a Ghostbusters backpack or a time machine. And I hated the idea of like, okay, this is nice, but now we're gonna throw in the trash, right? Yeah. So I recently got him a shelf set up in his room where I was like, I want him to have somewhere to display these things rather than have them just kind of
Unknown Speaker 39:48
lay on the floor. Yeah.
Unknown Speaker 39:52
And his room has stayed clean ever since. Like, it keeps a clean and he makes his bed because he just I think it gave him permission to lie
Unknown Speaker 40:00
Like,
Unknown Speaker 40:01
display who he is.
Unknown Speaker 40:04
Yeah. And I think a kid takes a lot of pride in a space that feels reflective of them. That's why they're always asking, Can I paint my room? That's crazy color can. Can you buy me this furniture? Like they they kind of I think they know. They know that they could create that space that reflects them, I think. Yeah, yeah. Oh, and I think it's important to allow that, like you're saying, you know?
Unknown Speaker 40:27
Yeah, yeah, for a while, I felt like I like it needed to meet an aesthetic instead of be theirs.
Unknown Speaker 40:36
So I do want to confirm for you and for anybody listening. I've talked about this before on my podcast, but my room was pure chaos. I had pop cans hanging from my ceiling. I had posters. Florida didn't clean, but it was chaos. So yeah, yeah.
Unknown Speaker 40:50
And now look at me, like, yeah, it's possible. I think that was food to the foods my kids won't eat, I can remind myself, I didn't eat those either. And now it's fine. People will change, we have to allow them the space to change, we have to allow them to be on their own messy journey. I mean, we have standards, right? We we clean up on Saturdays, Saturdays is when we clean the rooms as best we can. But we can maintain that and then all the other time just just, you know, enjoy it. Be enjoy your space, enjoy your people. Don't make it so pressured and filled. I love the idea to have a kid just owning their space. Like my kids rooms, I think are really them. They have picked out paint colors they have picked out, you know, whatever they want to hang on their walls. My daughter who's very crafty her desk is just like coated in layers of paint and glitter. And, and sometimes I'll go in and there's just glitter everywhere.
Unknown Speaker 41:47
Yeah, trailing through the whole house. But I want that for her. I want her to be able to be who she is. And she's a creator, and just give her that space to do that. At the risk of having glitter trailing to the rest of my house. But that's a whole other vacuuming situation. Right? Right. Oh, but I love that I truly do because I feel I feel so much that same way.
Unknown Speaker 42:08
But I want to ask you, I guess, Have there ever been a thing where your kids like, I want to paint this color? Or I want this furniture? And you're like, oh, okay, like we kind of you know, you have to like hold by your tongue. Sometimes I Yeah. Yeah. Like, Well, I wouldn't like that. But if it's your taste?
Unknown Speaker 42:24
No, yeah, I think there is like, my son wanted to paint his room red. And to me, that was probably where I draw the line. I'm like, we'll put something red in here. But we're not going to paint a ball read that. That's a bit much. And so he ended up we have just so much paint in the basement storage. So we ended up finding some kind of like, lime green paint and painted it that's
Unknown Speaker 42:45
yeah, no, it's fine. Your kid whatever. Oh, that's so fun that you let them have that creativity, though. You know, I hate that. I say let them but some people don't. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I know, I remember they would dress themselves growing up. And my daughter never wore matching socks, like, maybe not even matching shoes some days. And people would say to me, I appreciate that. You can do this for your kids. I could never like my kids have to have matching socks. Their shoes have to be a certain way. And even my mind boys, they wear shorts all year long in Canada through the snow through all weather. You know, there's like a temperature where they have to wear snow pants, but they're wearing shorts. And I just really want to give my kids that autonomy. That it's their bodies. It's it's their rooms. And yes, we have standards. Like there's a breaking point where we put snow pants on. There's a point where we do a Saturday morning chore. But I think there's a lot of beauty in just seeing who your kids become.
Unknown Speaker 43:44
And I think I had that as a kid. Like you describe your room with the pop cans and the post posters everywhere. I remember magazines, 17, magazine, posters everywhere. I had things like dangling from the ceiling that I would create. And I felt like then my room was an expression of the the most chaotic version of me, but still an expression of me. Right. But I also think and that's what my mom would always say, you're so artistic. You're so creative. It was a good thing. It wasn't like this place is a disease. She was really good about vocalizing it in a positive way.
Unknown Speaker 44:16
But you're so right, like, the most chaotic expression of you. But when I think about it, I'm like, my child is still a whole person. And they only have this one little space to express themselves. I get the rest of the house. You know, literally Yeah, yeah, we get the rest of the house. Yeah. Yeah. And if I look around my house, I've made every single decision, what hangs where, what exists, where it's put how long it stays there for other than like my husband's a hunter, so there's a goat and an elk in our entrance. That took a lot of negotiation
Unknown Speaker 44:50
to get it up there. But I do notice that like this home is actually a reflection of me and who I think my filter and my view of our family is
Unknown Speaker 45:00
But to give my kids their own rooms and their own space, I remember having fantasies as a child, that I would have this like drop down in my closet that I would go down to my own apartment underneath everything. And all the ways I would design, you know, I think I was actually just really into design too, because I was like a teenager watching HGTV or like house in home, it was called in Canada. And I was so into that, because I knew early on that your space makes you feel something that you go into a space and you feel a certain way. And that's how I have approached my home over the past 10 years is how it makes me feel how does it make me feel that this wall like this, or this chair over here, how do I feel in that space. And to me, that's what I wanted to create all along, growing up in a space that was cluttered, where I didn't really feel like I had room for all of the things and all the spaces other than my bedroom like that was mine. But just going into, you know, the kitchen table was always full of stuff, the living room was full of stuff, and just not having that feeling that I wanted to feel in my house on a regular basis. I had to take that into consideration as an adult when I was intentionally putting my home back together. Yeah. Do you feel like I've I'm not trying to call out like an entire generation. And that's not necessarily true. But I think that's true for a lot of people probably in our age range that I want to say the boomer generation, I don't want to necessarily clump them all together. But I know it's true for you know, my husband's family and my my family. I think my mum got a little bit more cluttered as she got older. Maybe like when I left the house, so it might have been
Unknown Speaker 46:38
a coping mechanism, you know, yeah, like the home backup when it started to feel empty, maybe.
Unknown Speaker 46:44
But I've seen such a shift and I can't help I wonder if that's part of why there's so many minimalists in our, you know, Jen, or the Gen X millennial range, because we're like, oh, gosh, we have to over like we have to overcompensate, who was what we grew up with? Yeah, I think it really could be a reaction to what our parents were doing, because they were raised by, you know, that generation that maybe went through the Great Depression, and they saved everything, I would go visit my grandparents who had a very modest apartment, and they just had what they needed. But they would have random weird things that they had collected and saved because I had value. Like a giant bucket. I remember my grandmother giving me a giant bucket one time because it's good bucket, it's a good bucket, I was like, Sure, sure I'll take the bucket or drawer poles or these pants that they slacks, like they just felt this is valuable, I can't get rid of it, I have to give it a home. And I think that's echoed in our parents, who also I don't know if you're the same, but
Unknown Speaker 47:43
they have their parents stuff now. So they feel that obligation to hold their own parents things. And so I have both sets of my parents who have their parents items in their home. And my mum's also gone, she lives in care home, she has dementia. So my dad is just one person living with the possessions of about, you know, five other people plus himself plus anything we left as kids. And I think there's a sense of duty and obligation to care for those things and create space for those things. But we don't want it like I've told him a few times, if something happens to you, I have to quit my job and move in and go through your things for months on end. And I think that's a that's a real concern that we have to talk to our parents about what's going to happen. Like, who's going to do all of this, you got to start now. There's that show? Sorry, I'm going on tangent here. There's that show the gentle art of Swedish death cleaning? It's on prime I think right now. That's so good, right? I made my dad watch an episode of that. And just to say, like, you could you could have freedom from all of these things, I can help you. But it's, you know, he's lived like that. His whole life for generations of holding all these people stuff is going to be so hard for them to just let go of it. Right. That is that's a lot for one person to feel that weight like like the physical, mental, emotional weight, right? And that's something I try so hard to convey is like,
Unknown Speaker 49:16
this, our stuff is not us. It's not our things you don't I mean, it's so hard. I think sometimes to detach ourselves from that emotional connection to the people we love. And the clutter that we hang on to you know, yeah, that's probably one of the more common questions I get. And maybe you too. What do I do with the stuff that grandmas China? What do I do with the stuff that I feel like I have to keep? Especially if I'm the only one in the family who's keeping it kind of for the family? What do I do? Can I declutter these things? Can I declutter, you know, these old dishes, these old clothes, these old like, memorabilia Can I do that? And yes, you can. If the stuff isn't honoring, if you're putting the stuff in a place where it's
Unknown Speaker 50:00
are honoring someone, you could display that some of that China, you could frame things, you could put them up on the wall. Like considering my grandparents who I was really close to, they left me their dish set, and it's not something I would have chosen. But I just wanted to own that. So if this is what I have from them, I want to give it a space in my kitchen, and I want to use it and I want to, you know, honor them by using those dishes and maybe one will break. That's okay. But that's something that I wanted to make sure that it wasn't just going to sit in the basement. And, and not, you know, be there to remind me of them and interact with their living memory all most of these things. Yeah. And that's, it's so huge that you intentionally chose that thing. That for me, I'm like, my mom has said something about, you should have the pictures of your parents on your wall. And like I don't, I don't like wall clutter. So I don't actually have photos of my own family on my wall makes me sound like such a cold heartless person. We've got photo books that I started making, but I the visual clutter on my wall. Gives me it makes me feel stressed. Yeah. So I don't do that. But I do have like my grandmother. We had like we went out to eat and there was just a plain paper nap.
Unknown Speaker 51:15
placemat. Yeah, and she folded it into a crane. She's from Japan. So she folded it into an origami crate. And I have it. I have like an empty frame on the shelves in my living room. And the crane is in the frame. So I'm like, This is my grandmother, like I'm really honoring and hanging on to her. I don't need her photo on my wall. I don't need to hang on to all her stuff. Like to me, this is her. You know, he Yeah, I think it's important to pay attention to what items you're really drawn to give them a space of honor in your home. And that's what decluttering does, it removes all of the distractions. So ideally, what you're left with are meaningful things that you love looking at. And so you're going to come into your home, and it's going to feel like a bit of a sanctuary, a bit of an altar, a bit of just this like oasis that is designed just for you. Now plus, plus laundry.
Unknown Speaker 52:08
Right?
Unknown Speaker 52:09
Perfect. That was like the perfect. I feel like a wrap up or summary of our whole conversation. Thank you so much, Shauna. So, buddy, who wants to connect with you more? Where can we find you? Yeah, the easiest place to us on Instagram. I'm at simple on purpose.ca That ca because I'm in Canada. And from there, you can find links to everything. And I'm gonna tell us a little bit about your podcast as well. Oh, yeah. So my podcast is called simple on purpose, and you can link to it there. And I think we're just echoing a lot of the same themes, which I think women can't hear enough of if if they are drawn to that. And it empowers them then. Yeah, keep digging into minimalism. decluttering and just living intentionally, I think those are all important things. Oh, absolutely. Well, thank you so much. Yeah. Thanks, Minnie.
Transcribed by https://otter.ai
